[chopperbill]

I didn't just make this up. I did the experiment not a theory and it didn't take me 30 years to figure it out. Go and plug your out side source of air and start the motor. It will run. It is pulling air from the clutch air tubing. Now plug the clutch air tube. Motor will quit and wont restart. K&N in the grumpy mod starts getting plugged with dirt. Stomp on the gas, motor calls for lots of air. K&N cant supply all it so the least resistance is the clutch tube which exits the rear above the motor, the dustiest area of the machine. Oh, yes the K&N can plug to where the motor is starving for air. There is a post just today from an unhappy customer.

I don't understand. I can plug up my snorkle air intake with plastic so there is no air infiltration and the motor will die out immediately on my 2011 50". If it will suck enough from somewhere else, why is this?

GJRonK

Cause you got it snorkeled. The stock engine and clutch air intake is in the same box and shares the same air intake. The clutch draws it air from the same source and it exits out the back of the cab above the motor. Plug the air intake and the motor will draw air backwards through the clutch duct work. If you have completely stock air intake just plug the air slot. Motor will keep running. Air has to be coming from somewhere to do this. In this case its coming through clutch duct work backwards.

 

[GJRonK]

I didn't just make this up. I did the experiment not a theory and it didn't take me 30 years to figure it out. Go and plug your out side source of air and start the motor. It will run. It is pulling air from the clutch air tubing. Now plug the clutch air tube. Motor will quit and wont restart. K&N in the grumpy mod starts getting plugged with dirt. Stomp on the gas, motor calls for lots of air. K&N cant supply all it so the least resistance is the clutch tube which exits the rear above the motor, the dustiest area of the machine. Oh, yes the K&N can plug to where the motor is starving for air. There is a post just today from an unhappy customer.

I don't understand. I can plug up my snorkle air intake with plastic so there is no air infiltration and the motor will die out immediately on my 2011 50". If it will suck enough from somewhere else, why is this?

GJRonK

Cause you got it snorkeled. The stock engine and clutch air intake is in the same box and shares the same air intake. The clutch draws it air from the same source and it exits out the back of the cab above the motor. Plug the air intake and the motor will draw air backwards through the clutch duct work. If you have completely stock air intake just plug the air slot. Motor will keep running. Air has to be coming from somewhere to do this. In this case its coming through clutch duct work backwards.

--
Okay, now I understand. Since both air cleaner filter and clutch are both drawing air from the same collecting supply box between the seats, if you plug access to air for the supply box then the engine will draw backwards from the clutch tubing. Your stock air filter is still working, but now has the dirtiest air possible, much more dirty even than from between the seats. So unless you had a fantastic air filter, you wouldn't last long riding even if you were by yourself (unless you were in completely dustless dirt).

GJRonK

 

[hoser]

I use a paper filter in my mod. I made the hole so it would fit snug. I can just pull it out and give it a couple of taps and it cleans out. Cant do that with a K&N "filter". Best part is they are only $6-$8. I even wash mine out with warm soap and water every once in a while and get extra life out of it. Cant hurt the integrity of it because its just a pre-filter anyway.

On edit: Your dust in the box could be because your engine is "stealing" air once in awhile from the exhaust tube coming from the clutch. Can happen under certain conditions.

Air takes the lease opposition to flow your telling us that the engine is going to suck the air through a hole 5x smaller ans several inches in length than the air filter that is only 1/2" thick, nice theory but I dont buy it been doing air flow for a living for more than 30 years things like that just dont happen.

I didn't just make this up. I did the experiment not a theory and it didn't take me 30 years to figure it out. Go and plug your out side source of air and start the motor. It will run. It is pulling air from the clutch air tubing. Now plug the clutch air tube. Motor will quit and wont restart. K&N in the grumpy mod starts getting plugged with dirt. Stomp on the gas, motor calls for lots of air. K&N cant supply all it so the least resistance is the clutch tube which exits the rear above the motor, the dustiest area of the machine. Oh, yes the K&N can plug to where the motor is starving for air. There is a post just today from an unhappy customer.
LINK TO POST

I have had my filter loaded really well many times in the past never had any of the problems your describing nice theory tho keep pushing it maybe it will make you money like K&N cashes in :rofl3: on their products daily..

PilotOdyssey.com • View topic - Prefilter Mod By hoser.. RZR

 

[chopperbill]

Air takes the lease opposition to flow your telling us that the engine is going to suck the air through a hole 5x smaller ans several inches in length than the air filter that is only 1/2" thick, nice theory but I dont buy it been doing air flow for a living for more than 30 years things like that just dont happen.

I didn't just make this up. I did the experiment not a theory and it didn't take me 30 years to figure it out. Go and plug your out side source of air and start the motor. It will run. It is pulling air from the clutch air tubing. Now plug the clutch air tube. Motor will quit and wont restart. K&N in the grumpy mod starts getting plugged with dirt. Stomp on the gas, motor calls for lots of air. K&N cant supply all it so the least resistance is the clutch tube which exits the rear above the motor, the dustiest area of the machine. Oh, yes the K&N can plug to where the motor is starving for air. There is a post just today from an unhappy customer.
LINK TO POST

I have had my filter loaded really well many times in the past never had any of the problems your describing nice theory tho keep pushing it maybe it will make you money like K&N cashes in :rofl3: on their products daily..

PilotOdyssey.com • View topic - Prefilter Mod By hoser.. RZR

Like I said it aint a theory. And I aint got to pushing nothing especially those dirt sucking K&N's. Good gawd all you got to do is do the test I did. Common sense will tell ya if the main source plugs up the motor is going find air some where else. If it don't it quits running. The air it is finding is from the CLUTCH AIR TUBES. AND we are talking about installing the Grumpy filter mod which you probably dont have. You say you have been doing air flow for 30 years? :rofl3:

 

[hoser]

I didn't just make this up. I did the experiment not a theory and it didn't take me 30 years to figure it out. Go and plug your out side source of air and start the motor. It will run. It is pulling air from the clutch air tubing. Now plug the clutch air tube. Motor will quit and wont restart. K&N in the grumpy mod starts getting plugged with dirt. Stomp on the gas, motor calls for lots of air. K&N cant supply all it so the least resistance is the clutch tube which exits the rear above the motor, the dustiest area of the machine. Oh, yes the K&N can plug to where the motor is starving for air. There is a post just today from an unhappy customer.
LINK TO POST

I have had my filter loaded really well many times in the past never had any of the problems your describing nice theory tho keep pushing it maybe it will make you money like K&N cashes in :rofl3: on their products daily..

PilotOdyssey.com • View topic - Prefilter Mod By hoser.. RZR

Like I said it aint a theory. And I aint got to pushing nothing especially those dirt sucking K&N's. Good gawd all you got to do is do the test I did. Common sense will tell ya if the main source plugs up the motor is going find air some where else. If it don't it quits running. The air it is finding is from the CLUTCH AIR TUBES. AND we are talking about installing the Grumpy filter mod which you probably dont have. You say you have been doing air flow for 30 years? :rofl3:

Good GOD I did the test you did here is some more of the results you can see how much dirt has been in with my belt PilotOdyssey.com • View topic - RZR Belt Inspection at 1200, 1750 then 3226 miles. my filter has been plugged 3-4 times like in the last link and pics, I find about the same amount of dirt in my belt guard as I find on top of the TV in my living room after about a month if you theory was right would it be that clean, I know where the dust is getting in its leaking where I mounted the filter not the connection I made with the K&N the connections Polaris made that I didnt seal yet not spending a full day taking my machine apart chasing 1/8 tea spoon of dust after thousands of miles of desert riding.

Air takes the lease opposition to flow simple science learned that the first month of my 30+ years experaince in HVAC working on everything from houses to nuke plants to hospitals, 100.00 projects to multi million dollar projects where we were chasing microns of dust particles, done years of test and balancing I am a qualified air flow expert, not self proclaimed either I hold certificates and a stack of pay checks that would choke a horse to back it lol.

Over 4500 miles on my RZR now about 4k in the desert just cleaned the K&N the other day after a dusty trip with friends inside of my air box is cleaner than the inside of my belt guard as seen in the pics on this post.

Your concerns are a NON issue for my machine , I have rock solid proof, but you seem genuinely concerned so you keep tossing out your red flag to the world I am sure it will help someone.

Thanks

 

[chopperbill]

GJRonK on the post above gets what I am saying and I am pretty sure he doesn't Have the 30 + years the "experience" you have. Have no idea what a Honda Pilot has to do with any thing we are discussing. It is relevant to the RZR air box. Enjoy your K&N and have many miles of trouble fee riding. Adios
On edit: just figured out that you may be defending a K&N filter and have no idea what it has to do with houses and nuke plants. Happy Holidays!

 

[GJRonK]

...

Air takes the lease opposition to flow your telling us that the engine is going to suck the air through a hole 5x smaller ans several inches in length than the air filter that is only 1/2" thick, nice theory but I dont buy it been doing air flow for a living for more than 30 years things like that just dont happen.

--
Hoser,
As a matter of fact, yes, the RZR engine will suck enough air through a small hole to keep running. I agree with you that an engine will draw from any supply with the least amount of resistance. I have attempted to plug up my snorkel with a towel and was unsuccessful as the engine was sucking air right through the obstacle stuffed in tight. Certainly that couldn't have been a very large passageway in that condition. I could only stop the flow when I covered the towel totally with plastic that would not allow any leak.

I don't imagine you would have to draw copious amounts of air from a backflow through your clutch hoses to create a large amount of dirt in your filter box since the dirty air is probably pretty extreme.

But then I'm not an expert engineer making the big bucks.

GJRonK

 

[shanksyamaha]

I tried using K&N filters in my banshee racing days and it didn't take long to figure out that they let way too much dust and dirt in.. After just a few hours of operation in a 2 stroke banshee motor you can tear it down and tell by looking at the top end if a K&N filter was used in dusty conditions. I have one on my truck, but would never use one on an off road vehicle.

 

[hoser]

...

Air takes the lease opposition to flow your telling us that the engine is going to suck the air through a hole 5x smaller ans several inches in length than the air filter that is only 1/2" thick, nice theory but I dont buy it been doing air flow for a living for more than 30 years things like that just dont happen.

--
Hoser,
As a matter of fact, yes, the RZR engine will suck enough air through a small hole to keep running. I agree with you that an engine will draw from any supply with the least amount of resistance. I have attempted to plug up my snorkel with a towel and was unsuccessful as the engine was sucking air right through the obstacle stuffed in tight. Certainly that couldn't have been a very large passageway in that condition. I could only stop the flow when I covered the towel totally with plastic that would not allow any leak.

I don't imagine you would have to draw copious amounts of air from a backflow through your clutch hoses to create a large amount of dirt in your filter box since the dirty air is probably pretty extreme.

But then I'm not an expert engineer making the big bucks.

GJRonK

Your analogy has nothing to do with what I am talking about not sure why your struggling so hard to make a point about how hard a engine will suck air my comments are about what is really happening in the real world under normal operating conditions.

"I agree with you that an engine will draw from any supply with the least amount of resistance."

You seem to understand the basic science not sure why your still confused how much volume of air you think this engine is consuming that its going to exceed the factory intake opening and suck air from 2x further away and 1/2 the size your engine must be turning 20k rpm :rofl3:

 

[BarRZR]

Hoser;

Are you still running the K&N on your "Grumpy-Ride" mod? If so, are you running it wet or dry?

Cheers

 

[GJRonK]

--

Bar (and anyone else still following this thread),

I would suggest two things. First, as to the type of filter to use on a Grumpy Mod, that you go to this site and click on the drop-down arrow to air (filters) to consider a nanofiber filter. They can be used dry and are many times superior to a K&N.

Second, you may want to look at the thoughts and presentation of Hoser and several others in order to compare rationale for your actions and possible results. It's often better to do some research before completely believing any "expert" in any field. Some of the best "experts" are way off base but too stuck in their ways, and self-agrandization, to recognize reality.

Just some thoughts.

GJRonK

 

[locustforkrzr]

My experience and 2 centz.
Re ringing my RZR right now. I was running K&N filter in my S&S intake. I cleaned it about every other ride and I do ride in some dusty conditions at times. The inner wire mesh unravelled and a hole was sucked in through the fabric. It went to using oil real fast, within 60 miles of last cleaning and filter oiling.

I ran stock paper filter many months prior to K&N and I cleaned it about as often as I do the K&N and never had an issue.
Use your own judgement but my is based in personal experience.

 

[J to the B]

I chose not to use the K&N as my main filter on the RZR, I do use it as a pre-filter. I have had one on my quad for 8 years with no problems......at all. I clean and oil it after every ride. I also use the K&N Cold Air Intake in my truck.