I personally don't agree with the product Amsoil recommends for use in both the transmission and rear end (ATV/UTV Differential and Transmission Fluid). I think they missed a critical difference between the two applications. The factory transmission and Tx case are not lubed with gear lube. The rear end uses gear lube, the transmission uses a fluid more akin to ATF or hydraulic fluid. Its exact non-Polaris equivalent is unknown (unfortunately). The rear end needs gear lube, any will do. Amsoil's product is wrong for one or the other of these applications.

Many people swear by putting gear lube (such as 75w90) and a variety of other types in their transmission/Tx. I'm sticking with AGL. I don't want anything in there that doesn't have the climb rate and other properties Polaris selected for their machines. I don't want to mess with different seal swelling and compatibility either. I just buy the genuine stuff from discounters such as FixMyToys and get a good nights sleep. YMMV. JMO, I'm only at 8000 miles on AGL.

 

I've ran Lucas universal hydraulic oil in the front diff of every rzr I've ever owned and I've owned pretty much all of them. (10 800s, 12 900xp, 14 1000xp 16 xpt and 18 rs1) I've also ran 75w90 Lucas in the transmission and Brad Penn v2 10/40 or 20/50 depending on time of year in the engine in everyone as well. Never had a single issue with a front diff, transmission, or engine related to lubrication. I don't trust any oil manufacturer like amsoil that makes me go buy a product from vendor selling oil out of his garage. Just my 2 cents. I will stick with what has worked for the past 10 years. Still great info here though.

 

Why dot you just email Amsoil? They will give you the answers you are looking for.

 

Buy some John Deere hygard, can be bought in quarts on amazon and run it in the front diff. I have been to the factory where they make these and watched them put it in.

Run any gear oil you want in the tranny, I prefer mobil one 75w whatever, Can't remember now.

 

Synthetic ATF in the front diff of every Polaris I have owned.

75W90 in the Transmission.

Used to use 5W20 in the older Polaris ATV/RZR 800 with the separate Transfer Case.

 

Good thing Polaris quit putting grease zerks on every pivot point there is on the suspension!!! We would be having a grease type/brand used debate too instead of everyone complaining about their suspension squeeking instead of just giving the maintenance points some grease, who cares what brand, just grease for no squeeks. Did I say maintenance??? If you question “off brand” lubes, go to your Polaris dealer and buy what they recommend and then you’re safe, right? Or are the suggested fluids that manufacture “x” recommends, are they designed to make those components last just long enough to get the consumer through the warranty period (which I guarantee you that you paid for that 6 month warranty anyways) just so they can sell parts??? To each their own and it’s all personal opinion.

 

All: Thanks!

Hunterworks: Yes, in fact I've done research on the Demand Drive Fluid in the hopes I could better understand what AGL is by learning what it is not. (reverse engineering of sorts) I agree with you completely. More on DDF in a different thread.

Itching: Rear end oil is different from transmission oil? OK, please coach me here boss. My turbo seems to have one fill/oil point for both tranny and rear end. Maybe we have different machines? Or am I being an idiot? (again).

Bullitt: I suggest you look for my DDF thread that is forthcoming. Prolly tomorrow.

Whiteford: Yes, of course. Do you recall me asking if anybody had any good contacts? A good contact name beats a cold call most times.

Pat: Uh.. What? Nevermind. I do appreciate your intent to help the community.

All:
I'm going to have to correct myself some. DDF is, and is only, low viscosity tractor hydraulic fluid. Deere J-20D to be exact, although we don't know what's in the DDF bottles. What that means is I should eliminate UTHF it as a likely candidate from the VOA of AGL. That leaves 5W-20 motor oil. Or a new possibility I'd not considered: A poor 75W-85 gear oil that specs like a light motor oil.

This would explain Amsoil's take, the position of some very learned folks on BITOG, and the experience of some here as well. It also supports the reason some of us think about this: The present hypothesis shows a substantial oil improvement is possible over AGL.

Darters:
Given your statement of regularly rebuilding these transmissions (different thread), I'm a little confused by your apparent lack of interest in the pursuit of better oils. Perhaps I can get you to reconsider? Your contribution and experiences would doubtless be of value. For what it's worth, this thread is all your fault. You'll recall the upper bearings in the transmission you reported are chronically failing.... (I'd still appreciate the failing bearing numbers too!)

All:
So OK, I've no more answers yet. It does seem some form of "climbing" oil is needed, and it's seems it will be a low viscosity gear oil. Yet I've also read warning about using oil too thick as it creates chain stretch. Oh dear, is Po right? Is AGL some kind of extra low viscosity gear oil, something testing out like motor oil? Crud, what if the components that contribute to making an oil "climb" aren't tested for in a oil analysis. (read much swearing in background).

Am I proving AGL is the right oil here? Good lord, this wasn't expected. (God, am I going to have to admit all the "I only use factory oil" guys are right?)

OK, a conversation with Amsoil is coming. I wonder how a manual transmission oil might do here?

Anybody got anything else to contribute?

respect to all,
d

 

All: Thanks!

Hunderworks: Yes, in fact I've done research on the Demand Drive Fluid in the hopes I could better understand what AGL is by learning what it is not. (reverse engineering of sorts) I agree with you completely. More on DDF in a different thread.

Itching: Rear end oil is different from transmission oil? OK, please coach me here boss. My turbo seems to have one fill/oil point for both tranny and rear end. Maybe we have different machines? Or am I being an idiot? (again).

Bullitt: I suggest you look for my DDF thread that is forthcoming. Prolly tomorrow.

Whiteford: Yes, of course. Do you recall me asking if anybody had any good contacts? A good contact name beats a cold call most times.

Pat: Uh.. What? Nevermind. I do appreciate your intent to help the community.

All:
I'm going to have to correct myself some. DDF is, and is only, low viscosity tractor hydraulic fluid. Deere J-20D to be exact, although we don't know what's in the DDF bottles. What that means is I should eliminate UTHF it as a likely candidate from the VOA of AGL. That leaves 5W-20 motor oil. Or a new possibility I'd not considered: A poor 75W-85 gear oil that specs like a light motor oil.

This would explain Amsoil's take, the position of some very learned folks on BITOG, and the experience of some here as well. It also supports the reason some of us think about this: The present hypothesis shows a substantial oil improvement is possible over AGL.

Darters:
Given your statement of regularly rebuilding these transmissions (different thread), I'm a little confused by your apparent lack of interest in the pursuit of better oils. Perhaps I can get you to reconsider? Your contribution and experiences would doubtless be of value. For what it's worth, this thread is all your fault. You'll recall the upper bearings in the transmission you reported are chronically failing.... (I'd still appreciate the failing bearing numbers too!)

All:
So OK, I've no more answers yet. It does seem some form of "climbing" oil is needed, and it's seems it will be a low viscosity gear oil. Yet I've also read warning about using oil too thick as it creates chain stretch. Oh dear, is Po right? Is AGL some kind of extra low viscosity gear oil, something testing out like motor oil? Crud, what if the components that contribute to making an oil "climb" aren't tested for in a oil analysis. (read much swearing in background).

Am I proving AGL is the right oil here? Good lord, this wasn't expected. (God, am I going to have to admit all the "I only use factory oil" guys are right?)

OK, a conversation with Amsoil is coming. I wonder how a manual transmission oil might do here?

Anybody got anything else to contribute?

respect to all,
d

Where are you using AGL then? It is not a ring and pinion (diff) lube.

BTW, a friendly suggestion--list your machine in your profile, or at least in your posts.

 

Motor oils and gear lubes are NOT measured on the same viscosity scale! You cannot compare them viscosity wise.

AGL stands for Angle Gear Lube

 

Yes. You'll note I mention the SAE J300 and J306 standards a few times in my opening post. Those are the relevant standards for motor oil and gear oil respectively. But it never hurts to point it out in case somebody not reading carefully, so thanks!

Now's probably a good time repost my second paragraph from the opening post:

"Today Amsoil stipulates a GL-5 gear oil rated at 75W-90 to replace AGL. However, while the cold flow viscosity of such an oil has quite a range, that range starts at 10W and could be as high as 20W (on the motor oil J300 table). Note then the possible range never touches the 0W-5W range AGL reportedly occupies."


d

 

This will be interesting to follow from an engineering/oil quality stand point but if you are looking at it from a cost saving stand point don't waste your time. I was just recently looking into alternative fluids from a cost saving stand point and found that the majority of the alternatives recommended by most people cost just as much as the Polaris brand oils if you buy them online and not from your local stealership. That's my two cents anyways.

 

We agree. But to be clear:

To a significant degree this is not about cost. As you guessed, it's an exercise (and a failing one at that) in attempting to improve transmission lubrication. Cost can, I must admit, have a tiny factor in engine oil, but that's not what we're talking about here. So unless it's based on unobtanium this thread is about improving reliability, not cost.

 

Never used OEM fluids, ever. Recommending the best oil has never been the goal of any oem manufacturer, rather it’s a business decision. OEM’s recommendations are marketed to persuade buyers and even induce fear, i.e. warranty void. It’s a business deal for the OEM, not a quality deal for the consumer.

Many have been able to purchase AMSOIL at Preferred Customers savings online, check it out AMSOIL UTV Product Lookup Guide

AMSOIL is the only oil I have used for over 25+ yrs, never would I use anything else. I value my equipment and I only use the best. Every thing in my signature has AMSOIL in every area that is lubed.

 

What the heck? A gallon of Polaris AGL costs $55 on Amazon. That's enough to change 3x (3years on my RZR). Front differential takes a whopping 8oz, so a quart of DD lasts 4 years. Not seeing a huge cost savings even if the replacement is half the cost per ounce.

 

Not to dumb down this conversation . But if the oil looks good still when you drain it ...then there is no big issue.

I have been running ( based on Nate's recommendations at Alba racing) Maxima Syn Blend 10w -40 engine oil in the last 4 RZR's we owned. My experience with the factory Pol engine oil is it breaks down and turn black quickly especially in Turbo models.
The Maxima goes about 2 times longer and typically looks good still when I change it .

In the transmission.... I have always used factory Polaris brand and it always looks about as good as it does going in ...I have seen very little breakdown

In the front Diff...I have used Amsoil and Polaris I do not see a difference between them. With both brands after 10 hrs of hard riding in 4 wheel drive it is black and very broke down . Since it only takes about 1/3 of a Quart and it is super easy to change , I just change it every 10 hrs depending on driving style and conditions

Here is a quote from Alba, from what I have seen I tend to believe them......

Alba take: The oil that comes in your RZR is junk. Yes we said junk. If your pour it and watch you will see it is very watery. We typically do not recommend running oils other than what the manufacturer recommends but Polaris oil is the exception and many learned this the hard way. The problem we see first is in the valvetrain. The camshaft will wear through the shim bucket and cause massive failure. Polaris themselves has come out with heavier duty buckets to help aid with this problem but it is a bandaid. Polaris has also come out with a extreme oil we assume due to the problems with there regular oil. We made the switch to Maxima oil in 2012 and immediately saw the benefits. No more problems. We will now never again use Polaris engine oil. On that note we only use OEM Polaris oils in every other part of the RZR (diffs, and transmission). So why would Polaris use such a poor oil? Our guess is to help meet new stricter emissions standards. About Maxima oil: Why do we use Maxima Synblend. The Maxima Synblend offers great quality oils and unlike automotive oils it is not EPA friendly and for use only for offroad/racing use only. It offers a very high zinc content which is a anti wear additive and also offers great cleaning properties. This is important as everyday we see these engine consuming dirt even with the best filtration systems. Your best line of defense against this is to change your oil often with good oil. Since we change the oil often full synthetic oil is not recommended as its extended life is not an issue. We have used this oil for 5 consecutive years in the SCORE series (1750 miles of grueling desert racing a year). We have won all 5 years with zero failures. We trust this oil and only this oil in all of our race vehicles.


I cant believe I just replied to an OIL thread....yep that just happened !

 

Itchin:

Good suggestion. Will do. Thanks. (now done)

Richard:
Thanks for the coaching. Never been or touched an 800. Good to know. Thanks.

All:
Guys, I'm only talking about AGL here. And not from a cost perspective. No shits given about cost. Darters, and a few others, have mentioned they've seen chronic transmission failures in upper bearings. I'd like to avoid that. I also am not impressed in general with Po's oil's (DFF seems to be fine though), and so suspect AGL. Granted with little data beyond what I've mentioned.

Is it possible the bearing failures would have occurred regardless of oil? I suppose.

This then is an attempt to gather data. I'm hoping we can get vendor that work on these to chime in, but of course most will see this as "just another oil" thread. Not sure I blame then. But if we stay on a data driven focus perhaps we can forward our knowledge enough to be of value.

I've a few thoughts to add, but my wife wants to out to dinner. More later.

My best to all,
D

 

My .02. I run 20% Lucas Synthetic additive in my RZR transmission, with the other 80% being AGL.

I had a 2014 Ranger 800 6x6 for 4 years, they are known to have transmission issues. I pulled it apart one winter and saw quite a bit of wear. I rebuilt the trans, filled with 20% Lucas and then did not change the fluid for an entire year on purpose. I pulled the transmission back apart and it looked great inside. My personal testing made me a believer. I think having a “sticky” additive that won’t run off the bearings, gears and chains helps with wear.

I have absolute no scientific data to back it up, just something I tried and I believe it helps.

 

I'm interested in additives, particularly those that aid in "climb". And yes, while close, since its only personal experience, it's has a data point: same machine went from failing to looking good. That's authoritative in my (feeble) mind. Is there only the one kind of Lucas additive? If not, which one did you use? Do you know how or what it's supposed to do?

Finally, I listen to the snowmobile guys. It's a community that has been pushing oil performance as long or longer then the MX guys have been, and certainly longer than the UTV or ATV community has even existed.

Thanks for the insight!

-d

 

OK, back from dinner. Allow me to summarize data I’ve been able to accumulate and/or surmise regarding AGL:

• It’s not low viscosity hydraulic fluid. That’s what Demand Drive Fluid is.

• It’s not 75W/ “nnn” (SAE J306) gearcase oil. That’s what Angle Drive Fluid is, and it would be hard on a chain application, which AGL must cover. More, VOA places AGL at viscosity below the admittedly wide threshold of 75W/85 (3 strikes)

• It’s not ATF Type F. Polaris once used ATF type F as an alternative to DDF, (Why have two matching products?), and typical ATF is not well oriented to gearcase applications — It’s not intended for high pressure applications (not GL-4 or GL5 listed, etc). In fact, ATF is largely a hydraulic fluid itself, not a gearcase oil. (3 Strikes)

• It needs to be chain compatible, and so some type of climbing action is indicated. This is suggestive of chaincase oils and manual transmission oils. In fact, Amsoil once specified their chaincase oil before they began specifying their 75W rated gear oil (The very one I’m questioning in this thread title).

• There seems to be a loophole in what I’ve seen of the SAE J306 tables. There does not seem to be a lower viscosity listed below 70W, (70W isn't even shown on the table Z15 as good enough to add) and it’s 100c viscosity states “4.1 Minimum”, which is no different than 75W gear oil. But minimum? Could there be an oil that meets 5W (J300 specs) and it's simply called 75W?

This final bullet is making me nervous. AGL is, or should be anyway, an oil with a higher load/higher bearing pressure additives package (like GL-4 or GL-5), that is no higher than J300 viscosity 5W. I know of no SAE rated gear oil that meets that criteria! (again, I’ve not looked into chain or manual transmission oils yet).

Polaris doesn’t make oil. Are they having something custom blended, or is there an SAE standard oil (maybe manual transmission oil) I’m missing? Or are we to learn there is no industry based superior offering to AGL? Additive packs withstanding perhaps.

Again, I’m quite certain there are oils that “work”, or at least appear to. This isn’t that exercise. This is “how can we improve the oil we’re using?”

Anybody got more? Know anything about chaincase oil or manual transmission oils, how they handle higher bearing loads, how well they climb, and finally what their cold viscosity might be?

Thanks all!
-D

 

Good thread BTW. I too don’t care about the cost, I just use what I feel is the best lubricant for my rig. If someone has proof of something better I’d be inclined to switch.

 

Thanks Snow. I find if I don't run these things down and document them someplace I loose track of the mental thread and a year two later I'm starting over. This time I hope to run these to ground.

Off topic: Po's engine oil - I don't consider it worthy of much debate. Plenty of better oils exist. I happen to have settled on 5-40 T6, but then I run it my VMax, my truck, my son's truck and vette, etc.. Great multi-purpose oil. So I'm just not gonna start a thread on it.

All:
Between dinner and the world serious I've had more time to think and read. Follows are some informative links for those inclined to ponder these things, and a few more thoughts.

Links:
https://www.farmoyl.com/resources/sae-viscosity-grades

https://widman.biz/uploads/Transaxle_oil.pdf

https://www.amsoil.com/techservicesbulletin/Drivetrain/TSB%20DT-2005-09-21%20Tackifier%20Additives%20Used%20in%20Gear%20Lubes.pdf

There are more, but that's enough for now. Observations:

* I've moved into thinking about oil characteristics by standards. For coverage for hypoid gears (our transaxles), I've thinking about the gear lube standards GL-4 and GL-5. For chain coverage, at least as regards protecting from reducing stretch induced by thick gear oils, I'm looking at viscosity and, when available, SAE J300 ratings (when possible).

* I've also realized the automotive industry has combined transmission and final drive too. We know them as transaxles.

* Most folks believe you can smell GL-5 rated oils easily due to the heavy sulfur content. I've never heard anybody, myself included, mention the small of sulfur on AGL. So maybe AGL is, at best, GL-4.

* I've also learned many automobile 5W-30 oils would meet the old GL-3 rating. As you're recall, the VOA found AGL to resemble 5W-20..

Finally, do you know what happens when you start looking for low cold viscosity transaxle fluids that meet Gl-4 specs? You find high end synthetic ATF Fluids. I'm no more a Redline advocate than I am an Amsoil fan (I'm relatively neutral), but:

https://www.redlineoil.com/content/files/tech/ATF%20PDS%201-10.pdf

I'm sure they aren't alone.

I'm going to build a table of pertinent oil specialties providers and being documenting cold and hot viscosities, pour points, and geal lube ratings. Then I'm going to call them and ask them to speak to their applicability in our application, and to speak to the "climb" issue. May take a few days. We'll see.

 

Politely asking, what’s the verdict? I need to change my oil this weekend....

 

At this moment, I can't give an opinion with any form of integrity or accuracy.. So use AGL.

Here's the problem:

In this case we have reason to believe AGL is inadequate.
https://www.rzrforums.net/rzr-xp-4-turbo/547566-help-broken-transmission-2.html

Look at posts #'s 10, 12, and 13. Those aren't the only references I've seen either.

I also think Amsoil (and Redline) are wrong. 75W oils is, per many many comments from those that work on chain drive systems, too thick. It can stretch chains and won't splash lubricate well. The oil Amsoil stipulated in 2014 and before was a chain-case oil. Why did they change when it was thin enough for a chain and would have "Splashed" well? My guess is it was hard on the hypoid gears (final drive).

BTW, Redline is calling for about the same thing, so Amsoil is not alone in moving to thicker oils. But we know Polaris isn't using thicker oils as AGL tests quite thin. ATF thin. Who's right? I don't know, and I may never get there. I wish Redline was open, but the fires in CA have literally run them out of their building.

That takes us to a GL-4 rated transmission or transfer case oil. Which one? I'm not sure, and may not get there. I suppose in this case I'm closest to saying a synthetic ATF with a high viscosity index that is also GL-4.

This looks like the best at this moment: (but its a guess!!)
https://www.redlineoil.com/d6-atf

But hard data is nearly non-existent. I've seen one VOA, and those are hardly a thorough analysis of an oil. Meanwhile AGL has no documentation, so we've no starting spot to try optimize from.

I can say this: I'll be asking Redline how they feel amount mixing their synthetic 75W90 GL-5 gear oil with the D6.... I'd run that if they told me I'd get the blended result I'm looking for. But oil often doesn't work that way.

So yea, for a safe answer use AGL.

More if I get any quality answers from Amsoil or Redline.

 

Sorry guys, I know a lot of folks just want the answer, but this one isn't clear. To me anyway. And it looks like it's been all over the board for years.

I think I'm close enough that I honestly think good GL-4 ATF would work and is probably better. And I true PAO based base stock would be really nice. Is it safe enough to tell an entire forum to use? No. What little we know of AGL makes it out to be a W-20w Motor oil, so it's not something magical, but I can't/won't lead you down a wild-assed guess.

I'll try to get this up onto BITOG and see if some of those oil guru's will comment.

-d

 

 

Z15:

I appreciate the contribution. Thanks. Do you happen to know what oil's were used? Just a few years ago they were specifying their chaincase lube for the transmission.

I know zip about Rangers. Does it have it's own rear diff fluid, or is it intergrated into the transmission?

In my mind AGL is being pushed in conflicting directions in the RXR 1000's and similar, in that the rear differential is being lubricated by the same fluid as the transmission. I'm a layman, but I'd have expected a rear differential to have been better served by a GL-5 rated 75W-90, and the transmission to have been better off with an ATF, manual transmission fluid, or even 5W-30 engine oil.

Thanks again,
D

 

Email sent to Amsoil -

Amsoil Technical Support:

I’m hoping for clarity regarding Amsoil’s product recommendation for transmission/transaxle fluid for a 2018 Polaris Rzr turbo. The Polaris oil recommended is Polaris AGL. The confusion about Amsoil’s recommendation comes for the following conflicts:

• Historically Amsoil recommended your Synthetic Chaincase & Gear Oil for this application, although at times Amsoil has also recommended it's synthetic tractor hydraulic fluid as an AGL alternative. In the last few years, really since Amsoil created a specific AT/UTV product line, Amsoil has specified your Synthetic ATV/UTV Differential and Transmission Fluid.

Amsoil’s Synthetic ATV/UTV Differential and Transmission Fluid is reputed to be a high quality synthetic 75W90 weight oil, but none the less a 75W base viscosity oil.

• Polaris AGL has been independently tested and shown to be essentially a 5w-20 motor oil, or perhaps an ATF. It's certainly not a 75w gear oil.

• The Polaris transmission includes upper bearings that require excellent “splash” lubrication and “climbing” characteristics sometimes associated with lighter oils. It also includes a chain drive component. Heavier gear oils, like 75W90, are often discouraged in such circumstances due to concerns of chain stretch induced by the heavier viscosity.

Note the original Amsoil recommendations not only conflict with today's, but don’t include the above concerns.

* The factory Polaris warranty is quite short, and Amsoil’s support of same doesn’t really offset the concern of longer term use.


Questions:
1) What is the actual gear weight rating (ie 75w90, etc..) of Amsoil’s Synthetic ATV/UTV Differential and Transmission Fluid?

2) Would you ask someone, possible with a product engineering background, to speak to the apparent 75W weight oil recommendation concerns of chain stretch and reduced splash, and inconsistency with Polaris’s own AGL viscosity?

3) Does Amsoil make an ATF that is GL-4 rated?

Let me be clear: This isn’t a challenge to the quality of Amsoil products. I’ve immense respect for Amsoil. While I hope I’ve shown there is superficial room to question this particular product recommendation, I’m confident Amsoil has an excellent response available.

My thanks,

 

• The Polaris transmission includes upper bearings that require excellent “splash” lubrication and “climbing” characteristics sometimes associated with lighter oils. It also includes a chain drive component. Heavier gear oils, like 75W90, are often discouraged in such circumstances due to concerns of chain stretch induced by the heavier viscosity.

Note the original Amsoil recommendations not only conflict with today's, but don’t include the above concerns.

* The factory Polaris warranty is quite short, and Amsoil’s support of same doesn’t really offset the concern of longer term use.

2) Would you ask someone, possible with a product engineering background, to speak to the apparent 75W weight oil recommendation concerns of chain stretch and reduced splash, and inconsistency with Polaris’s own AGL viscosity?

[/I]

What chain is in a Turbo transaxle?

 

Question submitted to Redline via their online contact form:

I’m curious about your recommendation for an alternative to Polaris’s AGL. You specify your UTV/ATV gearcase oil, a 75W80 weight oil, as a replacement for Polaris AGL, a roughly 5w-20 oil, and for Polaris Demand Drive, a 5W hydraulic fluid. That sure creates a number of questions, but I’m really only interested in a better AGL alternative.

In that the Polaris transmission/transaxle includes both hypoid final drive and a chain drive to its upper splash lubricated bearings, I’d anticipated a lighter oil. Something like Polaris specifies albeit with better sheer strength. Something like your D4 ATF. Using a 75W80 seems to be inviting chain stretch. I’m sure there is a good reason, and I’d sure like to hear Redlines thinking on this.

My thanks!

 

Bullitt427:

Good question. I've been taking information from other threads, and I have to admit here and there I've accepted a few things at face value. Really two come to mind:

1) Upper bearings in the transmission have been a failure point
2) Polaris uses AGL in all it's transmissions, not gear oil, and they include chain drives.

Now perhaps that is not the case for the XP1000/Turbo? I've not taken one apart.. Do you know?

Mind you in that Amsoil stipulates their 75W90 gear oil for ALl AGL applications the question is somewhat moot. But I personally would care a whole a little less. We still need to know more about oil climb to the upper bearing though.

Meanwhile I'll go see what I can find...

 

The XP1K has a reverse chain, no chains in a Turbo trans.

No issue with upper bearings in the Turbo trans, that was an issue with the XP1K being under filled, alleviated by being filled to 48 ounces.