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Discussion Starter #1
I’m needing some opinions on who’s dual rate set up to buy for my 19 XP1K. At roughly 900.00 bucks either way I go I don’t want it to be wasted. I’m looking to get a smoother ride on the trails through the rough stuff. Wooded trails, rocky trails, mud trails are my normal riding conditions. I do a couple dune trips a year. I’ve read several negative posts about the stage 4 ST kit. Red Dog doesn’t have a website that I can find so I have no idea what they offer. The ZBro kit looks the same as ST with the two piece cross over that seems to be a problem. I just want a good dependable set up I don’t have to worry about.
 

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You owe it to yourself to at least talk to Ed the Suspension Guy. I had a 2014 XP1000.
I talked to him and wound up buying new front shocks and revalving and respringing the rears. You may not need to go that far, but he will listen and give you the straight scoop.

When we did my 1k he wanted the weight of all the stuff I haul around, my weight, and my wife's weight. He then asked about where I ride, what I was looking for, and delivered exactly what I asked for.
He is on here, send him a PM. Be patient he has a full time job, but again...it'll be worth just talking to him...and listening to what he says. I am going to respring my Turbo S sometime next spring, and I will buy a package from him...not a one size fits all deal.

Just another opinion for you to mull over, LOL.
 

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I agree Ed is a great guy, I went with kings and HOLYSHIT what a difference! I had revalved rc2 and theirs no comparison , none
 

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Discussion Starter #5
You owe it to yourself to at least talk to Ed the Suspension Guy. I had a 2014 XP1000.
I talked to him and wound up buying new front shocks and revalving and respringing the rears. You may not need to go that far, but he will listen and give you the straight scoop.

When we did my 1k he wanted the weight of all the stuff I haul around, my weight, and my wife's weight. He then asked about where I ride, what I was looking for, and delivered exactly what I asked for.
He is on here, send him a PM. Be patient he has a full time job, but again...it'll be worth just talking to him...and listening to what he says. I am going to respring my Turbo S sometime next spring, and I will buy a package from him...not a one size fits all deal.

Just another opinion for you to mull over, LOL.
Do you know how I find Ed? I did a search in the PM and couldn’t find any thing with Ed the suspension guy.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
https://rtproutv.com/shop-by-model/rzr-xp-1000/rzr-xp-1000-replacement-spring-kit.htmlI went with the RT kit and it made a huge difference. So much that the wife noticed.
That’s really what I’m looking for. I try and take my wife on every ride. The suspension hasn’t bothered me too much but our last trip down to Mulberry Mountain in Arkansas I could tell the rocky trails were starting to get to her. If I can make it softer over the rocks I know she’ll enjoy it way more.
Is the RT kit a dual rate? I didn’t see a crossover in the kit. I’m completely new to the suspension stuff. This is my first RZR so I have absolutely nothing to compare what I have to what I could have. I do know there’s no way I’m spending 2500.00 or more for all new shocks.
 

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Do not think the RT kit has cross overs.
Adding longer correct rate upper springs with crossovers will do wonders for the slow stuff.



Sent from my iPhone using RZRForums.net
 

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Ed, The Suspension Guy
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I build the spring lengths and rate choices for the customers needs. Weights and cargo and terrain are significant parts of the equation to make spring rate choices.

Its NOT a one size fits all deal. It’s weird that some owners will purchase these general, generic spring rate choices spring kits? And add the fact that some kits don’t even give the spring rates your purchasing??? Sounds like a great deal to me?
Why would owners not want the best bang for the buck when purchasing springs to help improve the handling of thier expensive car Best possible?

Most owners have no idea how much better in every way their car can handle where they drive!
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I build the spring lengths and rate choices for the customers needs. Weights and cargo and terrain are significant parts of the equation to make spring rate choices.

Its NOT a one size fits all deal. It’s weird that some owners will purchase these general, generic spring rate choices spring kits? And add the fact that some kits don’t even give the spring rates your purchasing??? Sounds like a great deal to me?
Why would owners not want the best bang for the buck when purchasing springs to help improve the handling of thier expensive car Best possible?

Most owners have no idea how much better in every way their car can handle where they drive!
Im absolutely in the market for a spring set up for my car. Could you send me a PM with what information you’d like to have to create a set up for me?
 

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Perry, I appreciate some vendors offer solutions without crossover, but It takes away the opportunity to adjust your crossover point I suggest you ensure you select a vendor that includes crossovers. Personally I like the SDI (suspension direct) crossovers, but let your vendor guide you. I too hear good things about Ed, although I’ve decided to make my own decisions on springs. As to valving, I won’t invest any money on my existing front walkers. I’ll want something with user adjustable damping and rebound that is velocity sensitive. Which means buying better fronts. I sort of like the 2.5” walker velocities, but once again thats a “talk to your vendor” thing.


If it matters, I steer clear of ST for a few reasons, And don’t care for the RT solutions only because they don’t use crossovers. Which still leaves plenty of options. Btw, assuming you have walkers, you might talk them too. I’be found them pretty reasonable.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
At this point I’m not looking for a complete revalve or shock replacement. I’d like to think the WE shocks on my RZR could provide me with everything I’m looking for with a spring job. Just researching, as a Suspension noob, it looks like the dual rate with a crossover is the way to go. Again, being this is my first SXS I’ve got nothing to compare to. I just need to get with a trusted source that actually cares about their customer experience vs just taking their money.
 

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Ed, The Suspension Guy
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How much performance a owner gets from ANY SHOCK, depends on how it’s setup inside and out!

For example,
The walker 2.0 front can be set up to work excellent! (With my set up anyway). But!!! It has its limits being a smaller shock overall. It does not stand up to a ton of punishment. It will fade worse and more quickly as the temps rise and cannot cool fast enough. And it is more susceptible to breakage and failures.
But it’s great and will work well for the if not not pushed super hard for longer periods.
The problem is, when we make the car work so good, the smile meter goes way up, as well as driving confidants, and most drivers will step up their driving level and start to push the car to the new levels it’s now capable of.

If owners tell me they want to be able to drive at faster and more aggressive levels?? Rather than spend the cash to build the 2.0 that the owner may over drive in the end? Then I usually let them know they should probably step up to the 2.5 walker evans fronts. I have tuned and sold hundreds of these shocks!! So the tune has been constantly improved to the present level.
The shock is only as good as its tune! As with any Walker evans, Fox, King or any other brand.

Sadly, many owners have had bad or unfavorable experiences with particular shock brands and or packages. They feel that experience is the full example of that particular product without consideration for how the shock was set Up in the first place. The potential for a 2.5 or 3.0 shock is huge when set up properly. But if a driver/owner has never had the chance to drive and or realize these potentials? Then they will never know, until that new experience is realized. Until then, they gauge their opinion on the only unfavorable experiences they have. It’s tough! There are so many choices now days and it seams more and more people coming out of the wood work claiming to be suspension tuners. I’m sure they all have good intentions and hopefully will make an improvement.
But the owner has to ask themselves, how much better do you want your car for your money??? That’s the question!

So get out and drive, and increase those experiences to have a more extensive knowledge of what’s available to get the most for the owners personal car needs and wants.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
How much performance a owner gets from ANY SHOCK, depends on how it’s setup inside and out!

For example,
The walker 2.0 front can be set up to work excellent! (With my set up anyway). But!!! It has its limits being a smaller shock overall. It does not stand up to a ton of punishment. It will fade worse and more quickly as the temps rise and cannot cool fast enough. And it is more susceptible to breakage and failures.
But it’s great and will work well for the if not not pushed super hard for longer periods.
The problem is, when we make the car work so good, the smile meter goes way up, as well as driving confidants, and most drivers will step up their driving level and start to push the car to the new levels it’s now capable of.

If owners tell me they want to be able to drive at faster and more aggressive levels?? Rather than spend the cash to build the 2.0 that the owner may over drive in the end? Then I usually let them know they should probably step up to the 2.5 walker evans fronts. I have tuned and sold hundreds of these shocks!! So the tune has been constantly improved to the present level.
The shock is only as good as its tune! As with any Walker evans, Fox, King or any other brand.

Sadly, many owners have had bad or unfavorable experiences with particular shock brands and or packages. They feel that experience is the full example of that particular product without consideration for how the shock was set Up in the first place. The potential for a 2.5 or 3.0 shock is huge when set up properly. But if a driver/owner has never had the chance to drive and or realize these potentials? Then they will never know, until that new experience is realized. Until then, they gauge their opinion on the only unfavorable experiences they have. It’s tough! There are so many choices now days and it seams more and more people coming out of the wood work claiming to be suspension tuners. I’m sure they all have good intentions and hopefully will make an improvement.
But the owner has to ask themselves, how much better do you want your car for your money??? That’s the question!

So get out and drive, and increase those experiences to have a more extensive knowledge of what’s available to get the most for the owners personal car needs and wants.
All I’m looking for is a smoother trail ride over the rough stuff. Right now I’ve literally got a single spring system with nothing more than a spacer on top. I’m 40 years old, at this point in my life I’m not racing. I get a little “spirited” every now and then when the trail open up but I’m by no means launching this thing over jumps on a regular basis. The trails we ride are generally located in rockier areas. Most of the time it’s 5-10mph or less. I don’t feel an entire rebuild or shock replacement should be required just to get a smoother trail ride at 5mph. I don’t want it so plush I bottom out but I’d like it to handle the bumps better.
 

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Please excuse my ignorance, but what do you mean when you talk about crossovers? I'm 66 and have a 900 xp that I will never push to it's limit or do any significant jumps, so smoother suspension would be wonderful for my cruise mode driving.
Thanks
Alan
 

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Ed, The Suspension Guy
Joined
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699 Posts
How much performance a owner gets from ANY SHOCK, depends on how it’s setup inside and out!

For example,
The walker 2.0 front can be set up to work excellent! (With my set up anyway). But!!! It has its limits being a smaller shock overall. It does not stand up to a ton of punishment. It will fade worse and more quickly as the temps rise and cannot cool fast enough. And it is more susceptible to breakage and failures.
But it’s great and will work well for the if not not pushed super hard for longer periods.
The problem is, when we make the car work so good, the smile meter goes way up, as well as driving confidants, and most drivers will step up their driving level and start to push the car to the new levels it’s now capable of.

If owners tell me they want to be able to drive at faster and more aggressive levels?? Rather than spend the cash to build the 2.0 that the owner may over drive in the end? Then I usually let them know they should probably step up to the 2.5 walker evans fronts. I have tuned and sold hundreds of these shocks!! So the tune has been constantly improved to the present level.
The shock is only as good as its tune! As with any Walker evans, Fox, King or any other brand.

Sadly, many owners have had bad or unfavorable experiences with particular shock brands and or packages. They feel that experience is the full example of that particular product without consideration for how the shock was set Up in the first place. The potential for a 2.5 or 3.0 shock is huge when set up properly. But if a driver/owner has never had the chance to drive and or realize these potentials? Then they will never know, until that new experience is realized. Until then, they gauge their opinion on the only unfavorable experiences they have. It’s tough! There are so many choices now days and it seams more and more people coming out of the wood work claiming to be suspension tuners. I’m sure they all have good intentions and hopefully will make an improvement.
But the owner has to ask themselves, how much better do you want your car for your money??? That’s the question!

So get out and drive, and increase those experiences to have a more extensive knowledge of what’s available to get the most for the owners personal car needs and wants.
All I’m looking for is a smoother trail ride over the rough stuff. Right now I’ve literally got a single spring system with nothing more than a spacer on top. I’m 40 years old, at this point in my life I’m not racing. I get a little “spirited” every now and then when the trail open up but I’m by no means launching this thing over jumps on a regular basis. The trails we ride are generally located in rockier areas. Most of the time it’s 5-10mph or less. I don’t feel an entire rebuild or shock replacement should be required just to get a smoother trail ride at 5mph. I don’t want it so plush I bottom out but I’d like it to handle the bumps better.
Well, if you would like my help, you will need to call me, text me with a name and number and car you have. I will get back to you during my phone times.
I’m not on the forums often as I am working the fire job, working shocks, or out testing and tuning and driving off road cars.

You will need 4 new front springs, and spring dividers that are modified and act as a crossover also. (Money saving set up).
Depending on your weight? Passengers? And cargo? You may be able to get away with running your stock rear lower spring and only adding new upper springs and bolt on crossover nuts. This will more balance the car and also improve the ride over stock. You can install on your own. I will give you the instructions to set up to your needs.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Please excuse my ignorance, but what do you mean when you talk about crossovers? I'm 66 and have a 900 xp that I will never push to it's limit or do any significant jumps, so smoother suspension would be wonderful for my cruise mode driving.
Thanks
Alan
I’m no suspension guru myself but I’ll give it a go. Ed can chime in if I get it wrong. A crossover is used on a dual rate shock set up. Each shock has an upper and lower spring. The crossover is a threaded ring on the shock body. As the upper spring is compressed it pushes the crossover ring down to a stopping point which then forces the compression to the lower spring. Hopefully someone can tell me if I’m wrong or right but that’s how I understand it
 

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Please excuse my ignorance, but what do you mean when you talk about crossovers? I'm 66 and have a 900 xp that I will never push to it's limit or do any significant jumps, so smoother suspension would be wonderful for my cruise mode driving.
Thanks
Alan
I’m no suspension guru myself but I’ll give it a go. Ed can chime in if I get it wrong. A crossover is used on a dual rate shock set up. Each shock has an upper and lower spring. The crossover is a threaded ring on the shock body. As the upper spring is compressed it pushes the crossover ring down to a stopping point which then forces the compression to the lower spring. Hopefully someone can tell me if I’m wrong or right but that’s how I understand it
That's close. I built a DIY dual-rate system on my Fox shocks on my 2015 S900. Added a 350# spring on top of my stock 350# with a divider and crossover rings. So I get a 175# rate during normal riding but when I get a hard hit and the divider hits the crossover rings, it locks out the top spring and my rate bumps from 175 up to 350 to prevent bottoming out. The key is figuring out where to put the crossover rings; Ed can help you with that, and you can experiment on your own.

Some excellent reading here: The Truth About Dual-Rate Springs

ST also has some excellent articles about scrub radius when changing wheel offset, XP900 suspension upgrades and other suspension education.
https://shocktherapyst.com/articles/
 

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One thing to remember in the rock gardens; within limits, a little speed is your friend. Crawling the rocks too slow doesn't let your springs and shocks function; if the suspension doesn't compress and extend you might as well have a solid axle bolted to the frame.
 
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