Polaris RZR Forum - RZR Forums.net banner

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hey everyone just curious what the belt to shieve clearance should be on a XP 1000. And wondering if there is any benefit to tightening it up. I have over .120" and find my engagement to be a bit "notchy" .

I come from a snowmobiling background and belt to shieve is talked about alot on sleds and thought it was weird that I couldn't find any info on it for RZR.


Stock 2015 RZR XP 1000. New belt clean clutches and good rollers.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
784 Posts
I asked the same question a few years ago. No one had an answer for me.
So I took the thing apart and machined the spider (no shims to remove in mine) a bit to close up the clearance to around .060".
Seems to engage way smoother IMO. I have over 5000 miles on the clutch with no issues.

You may like it, you may hate it. I was willing to take a shot.
Do at your own risk.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Did you concern yourself with the balance of the primary? I considered machining it in a way that would result in the spider turning one full turn so as not to affect the balance. That would close down the gap by 0.087" I think (off the top of my head) putting me in the 0.030-0.040" range. I talked to a guy at SLP but he was pretty noncommittal about the benefit, whether I would need to rebalance, etc. Seems to me it would definitely be a benefit since I think I have around 0.125" clearance now.
 

·
Vendor
Joined
·
10,366 Posts
It would be beneficial but the reason you don't see it commericially available is so many vehicles are not perfectly aligned so when you tighten it up it has to be and has to stay that way.

I wanted to make our belts wider to take of that space but this is the reason we can't. I would be getting this as a review if I did, " Put the Hunterworks belt on and now my machines grinds into gear and with my oem it does not". When the whole time it would just be alignment that was not affected by the narrower belt.


Todd
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
I had considered alignment and I figured the only way to address that on my 1000S would be to shim the secondary out if that's the direction needed. Shimming the secondary inward to get proper alignment would pose a bigger problem, I think!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,063 Posts
We do to all our clients is take off the primary send to Indy Specialty Complete with weights and spring we want to run.-
They will shim to ( what spec we want for belt to sheave) I like .020
Completely tear down the clutch Machine where needed and balance the components - assemble - The last process is to balance the entire clutch assembly as a unit- ..
This is one reason you really don't want to invest into a aftermarket clutch add- on's as now you have upset/ and lost the unit's balance.
( Primary Lightweight clutch covers)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Like Todd mentioned, if your primary and secondary aren't in perfect alignment (radial centerline-to-radial centerline), you no longer have .020" clearance. How do you measure and adjust the clutch alignment after the belt-to-sheave clearance is set at .020 on the primary if the belt now rubs on one sheave or another on the primary?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,063 Posts
Your belt will have "witness marks" of where it is riding/rotating on the clutches
The goal is to have even wear marks on the belt
( both sides) . These will be found on the lower cogs, just have to look close. It will be noticeable if one side is displaying wear higher than the other.

Wash the belt in hot soapy water- give it a good scrub- dry- and take it out for a spin. add/remove washers on the secondary output shaft to get the secondary in alignment

Its an old sledders trick- same CVT system-and it gets you dialed in.
Does the secondary "float" to keep it in alignment- yes but no. Narrowing that margin will get it running true.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Thanks for the replys everyone. I think I will be removing some shims then if I have any. I will have to look into alignments as well.

I have read about aligning with witness marks before but never tried it myself
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,063 Posts
Thanks for the replys everyone. I think I will be removing some shims then if I have any. I will have to look into alignments as well.

I have read about aligning with witness marks before but never tried it myself
If you do not get it with shims ( check the helix cause sometimes they stick to it and are not seen) and you still need to adjust with the results of your findings of the witness marks- P/M me cause as you stated in your first post your a sledder- These motors along with sled motors-are dropped into a chassis with not much Q.A.Q.C. on alignment... All Manufactures! :sad
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
The SDI tool shown in your pic ensures the centerline of the primary and secondary are parallel. With that tool, the clutches will be aligned from the perspective of viewing from the side of the car. Now, step behind the car and consider the centerline of the primary and secondary relative to where the belt runs on both. On my 1000S there are no shims in the secondary or elsewhere to adjust this alignment. How do you make that alignment that would require moving the secondary towards the transmission or away from the transmission??
 

·
Vendor
Joined
·
10,366 Posts
Thanks for the replys everyone. I think I will be removing some shims then if I have any. I will have to look into alignments as well.

I have read about aligning with witness marks before but never tried it myself
There are not shims to align a 1000S, it is done in the engine to transmission mount and I do not know a way to do anything but center it. The SDI tool is the only one that really does it too.
 

·
Vendor
Joined
·
10,366 Posts
The SDI tool shown in your pic ensures the centerline of the primary and secondary are parallel. With that tool, the clutches will be aligned from the perspective of viewing from the side of the car. Now, step behind the car and consider the centerline of the primary and secondary relative to where the belt runs on both. On my 1000S there are no shims in the secondary or elsewhere to adjust this alignment. How do you make that alignment that would require moving the secondary towards the transmission or away from the transmission??
There is no side to side adjustment, just parallel shafts getting them perfect then it is aligned.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Thanks for the replys everyone. I think I will be removing some shims then if I have any. I will have to look into alignments as well.

I have read about aligning with witness marks before but never tried it myself
There are not shims to align a 1000S, it is done in the engine to transmission mount and I do not know a way to do anything but center it. The SDI tool is the only one that really does it too.

i have a 1000xp if that makes a difference,
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,458 Posts
We do to all our clients is take off the primary send to Indy Specialty Complete with weights and spring we want to run.-
They will shim to ( what spec we want for belt to sheave) I like .020
Completely tear down the clutch Machine where needed and balance the components - assemble - The last process is to balance the entire clutch assembly as a unit- ..
This is one reason you really don't want to invest into a aftermarket clutch add- on's as now you have upset/ and lost the unit's balance.
( Primary Lightweight clutch covers)
I didn't know Indy Specialty did work on SxS stuff. I know basically the same primary. I sent my snowmobile primary to them.

I had Adam at Airdam do the machine work on my primary.

I think there are only a small number of people that rework the OEM primary. Airdam, Indy , Next Level , 3P (I think) and that is about it.

Don't forget to dial in how much the primary shifts out. In most cases it is too much, which makes the belt ride too high and causes slippage , which causes heat which leads to a failure.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
268 Posts
Thanks for the replys everyone. I think I will be removing some shims then if I have any. I will have to look into alignments as well.
I have read about aligning with witness marks before but never tried it myself
There’s are no shims in the Drive Clutch. I think Highrider has the best suggestions. The alignment isn’t that great on the clutch’s and hasn’t caused me any problems with the three I have done. Heat is a bigger issue than alignment unless it’s way out and then it will generate heat. You are way out at .120 and really should do something. No mater how hard you try the clutch will never be perfect. Just the fact that the weights move and tip mass to base mass difference means that balance may change during shift out. .020 might be best but it isn’t necessary to get that tight.... .040 is where I’ve set mine and it makes the clutch smooth as silk. My clutches belt side clearance has varied between .067 and .081. There are enough washers behind the driven to shim it inward but finding the right washer thickness might be an issue.

One thing not mentioned is that you may have to lighten the weights a little to maintain R’s....that’s been my experience.

Another thing not mentioned is that starting with some or all 2018’s Polaris did not machine the towers all the way down so your pucks might hang on the rough part at engagement. That happened to my 2018 so I had to do some careful filing, a PIA.

I “do it myself” by taking the Spider to a machine shop to have the back machined. On my 2017 I had them take more off (.020) and then had an old Snowmobile .020 washer machined to fit. My thought was to add the washer and then have a shim to take off if I wanted to run .020. Since .040 worked well I just machined to .040 with later Spiders. When done, I have my clutch balanced without the weights and then balance the weights individually. In most larger cities there might be a Machine shop with the PTO stub to balance Polaris clutches.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
The belt-to-sheave clearance in the primary clutch is there to account for axial misalignment of the primary clutch and secondary clutches. My clearance measures about .120 also. Reducing the clearance by machining the spider or the spacer raises the possibility of causing the belt to drag on the stationary sheave or the moving sheave in the primary. If one were able to move the secondary or primary in or out (towards or away from the engine/transmission) to correct any axial misalignment then minimal belt-to-sheave clearance would be the ticket (as Todd pointed out, a wider belt would achieve the same thing). The problem, as I understand it, is there is no capability to shim or otherwise adjust for axial misalignment.

I'm going to see if I can make a jig to measure for axial misalignment on my machine. If it's close, I'm think I'm going to machine my spacer down by .083 (which is one turn of the spider). that will put me at about .037 clearance and eliminate the need to rebalance as the stationary sheave, spider and cover will maintain their indexing as it was prior to machining the spacer.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,458 Posts
The belt-to-sheave clearance in the primary clutch is there to account for axial misalignment of the primary clutch and secondary clutches. My clearance measures about .120 also. Reducing the clearance by machining the spider or the spacer raises the possibility of causing the belt to drag on the stationary sheave or the moving sheave in the primary. If one were able to move the secondary or primary in or out (towards or away from the engine/transmission) to correct any axial misalignment then minimal belt-to-sheave clearance would be the ticket (as Todd pointed out, a wider belt would achieve the same thing). The problem, as I understand it, is there is no capability to shim or otherwise adjust for axial misalignment.

I'm going to see if I can make a jig to measure for axial misalignment on my machine. If it's close, I'm think I'm going to machine my spacer down by .083 (which is one turn of the spider). that will put me at about .037 clearance and eliminate the need to rebalance as the stationary sheave, spider and cover will maintain their indexing as it was prior to machining the spacer.
That is why when one adds an aftermarket secondary, like STM there is some cross car float , just like a snowmobile. The set up on these RZR's really sucks. One car has zero issues while the next does. I'm sure it is due to build variations but there is no real way to correct them. That being said, we are asking a lot out of these CVT systems with the weight and hp we are dealing with.
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Top