Sounds like a short in the wiring some where

 

How so? With the awe symbol on the display and the diagnostic saying "on" for the awd does this not mean the electrical is working?

 

Did you put die electric grease in your connections? I had the front diff on my 05 rubicon not engage from water in the connection.

 

Rzr awd is an on demand system. The front wheels do not drive unless the rear wheels are sensed to be losing traction. When we ride in the winter on icy trails the rear will slide and then the front drive kicks in. Hope you get it figured out.

 

I have it raised up on blocks. It's not working.

 

2008 Right? My first inclination is that it's probably the sprague carrier. on the 08 it's plastic and with most any kind of rough treatment they self destruct. How about a little history? You have an 08 and 13 posts, I suspect you recently bought it used. Did the front drive ever work? Really need as much history as you can provide.

Mike

 

Hi mike, thx for the response. Yes its an 08. I just bought it last week and haven't gone over the machine . I am not sure if awd did ever work. I believe it did although the first time I tried to really use it nothing happened. U am also thinking its the Sprague Carrie as the electrical seems to check out good. Is there a way of determining of it is the sprague carrier? Without tearing it apart?

 

While you have it jacked up, put 12v to the diff- run engine in drive, if the front wheels dont turn you have an internal problem. and that year has a plastic sprauge that is prone to breakage. Good luck.

 

X2. You may want to look into a billet one. JMO

 

Also, 100% I would buy the aluminum one. I saw one on the superATV website for $140.00 if I remember right. It blows my mind that they use a plastic piece that engages the front diff. ridiculous.

I did not answer the question of did I put dielectric grease in the connection. No not yet, I cleaned everything and wanted to see if it worked before I greased it. As far as I know the grease is just to prevent further water penetration, not to aid the electrical connection.

Does anyone know, if while in diagnostic mode the AWD screen says "on", does this mean the front diff. is getting 12v power? The manual leads me to believe it is. If this is true then my problem is definitely internal and it answers my question of what to do next. While in diagnostic if I flip the AWD switch off the display says "off", flip switch on and display says "on".

 

grab a service manual from the link in my signature...
read it...

 

Ya, the read-outs are right, and you've done all the obvious diagnostic procedures, so everything, at this juncture, points to the sprague; extract differential, tear it down, replace sprague. My two-bits..........

Cheers

 

One thing to try before tearing down the front diff is to change the front diff fluid. Follow the directions precisely. There have been a few that have been revived by changing the fluid, so it's worth a try before taking the diff out and breaking it open.

If it's the sprauge, I would recommend getting one from Holz Racing. It comes complete with new rollers and spring tabs, completely assembled and ready to drop in. No messing around with trying to fit old worn parts into a new carrier, bending spring tabs trying to make sure they hold. Again if it's a broken sprague, make sure you clean all of the broken parts out of the housing, make sure it's absolutely clean. Another thing to check is the plate that gets pulled in by the coil, make sure it's flat and the tabs are straight. The Holz unit costs more (a lot more I think) but worth it.

Mike

 

I had the same problem on my 2008, the sprague was shattered when I pulled it out.

As for the 4wd working while jacked up, no the rears don't need to be spinning fast for the fronts to spin, if the rears turn 1/8th of a turn more then the fronts in 4wd (hi or low) the fronts should spin.

 

Take the wire coming from the diff and ground it to the frame.

 

New update,

Have been reading thoroughly through the service manual trying to learn about the electrical system. I am mechanically inclined with dirt bikes and older atvs (not as many electrical components) but this electrical stuff is brand new to me.

I am near positive the sprague carrier in my front end is shot. I will start to take it apart most likely this weekend unless I get different advice here.

Here is what I found. I disconnected the connection right near the front diff. Tested the "AWD hub coil ohm resistance" as manual states. I get 21.6ohms. The manual says 24ohms with a 5% difference allowance. So this is out of spec. My question is, does the difference really matter? I can not get my multimeter wires directly in the connection so I am thinking this is the reason for the difference. Also, on the chassis wires I can not get my multimeter in the connection and the voltage jumps all over the place as it is very difficult to get in there. It never went over 10 volts though but again the connection for testing is terrible. As previously said, the diagnostics on the display says "on" for the AWD screen which the manual says that means 12 volts is present.

I will update what I find when I take the front diff out. I am newbie with this machine so hopefully it will help anyone else that is unfamiliar with the rzr.

 

Well that is good news, means your coil is good (21.6ohms is fine) my money is on your sprague carrier, it's easy to check I had mine out in 1/2 hour.

When you open it up it'll probably look like this

 

Wow, thats a mess. What brand did you end up replacing it with? I am debating between holz sprague and superatv. Hands down the holz is better but if the superatv is up to the job then its my choice as the price difference is $180.00.

 

I bought a new xp front diff because I don't want to have to deal with it again,

 

If the sprague carrier isn't broken. it is the armature plate. More often then not that has been my problem. 4 armature plates and 2 sprague carriers.
If the armature plate has any warp, even very slight, there will not be enough drag to engage the awd.

 

You should read this thread completely.

http://www.rzrforums.net/general-rz...et/general-rzr-discussion/90931-another-5-billionth-front-diff-question-14.html

All i can say is I along with several others have had the same issue and replaced several things to only have to take the rzr apart again and again. Never actually fixing the issue and restoring the AWD. Do yourself a huge favor and send it to Jeff at JJ and A racing. He will fix it all and is a straight shooter. I just put my car back together yet again for the new year trip to the dunes on thursday and once AGAIN the problem is not fixed. When I return I will be once again ripping the diff out but this time the damn thing is going straight to him. Countless man hours, parts, trips to the dealership and hours upon hours of research all in the name of saving a dollar and doing it myself! A huge headache and a big pain in the ass. Read the thread (All 14 pages) and send it to him trust me.

 

well after some more research I cant seem to find that thread I posted the link too. It was active as of 2 days ago. Not sure if a mod deleted it and if thats the case thats a shame because it was very detailed. Anyhow good luck and I hope you take the advice of having a professional work on it lol

 

suscribed

 

Hi all,

New update, front diff is finally out of the machine. I had a hard time getting the roll pin out . Realized you need a 4 pound mallet and a good punch to get it out. Framing hammer won't do the job. Also, all of the diff cover screws stripped on me and I drilled them all out. Took a little while.

I have good and bad news at the same time. Everything in the diff looks really good. Not a single crack in the sprague carrier, no rust, oil looked clean, no metal bits, all splines look good, thrust plate was there, rollers look clean, h clips are all there. That's the good news but now I have no idea what's wrong.

Please read my previous posts for the history of what I have done so far but right now the only thing that wasn't perfect was my reading of the voltage at the plugin of chassis wire to diff plug. The coil checked out at 21.6 ohms but the chassis plug voltage was all over the place. Couldn't get my multimeter leads in the plug though so I am not sure if that's why.

Anyone have any suggestions at this point? Where should I look next.

 

I had a bad plug where the diff and main harness plug together once. replaced it with a waterproof connector from summit racing.

Did you check the armature plate for flatness?? It can look good and not create enough friction. Check it on glass, if it rocks anywhere replace it. If it is flat, power up the armature coil and put the plate on it. It should be fairly hard to turn, if it turns easy it needs replaced.

Like I said before, the armature plate has caused most of my problems.

Search my posts on the diff for all my problems and solutions.

 

Take it to the dealer and get it fixed right!!! The dealer and the people who work for him need to make a living. A technician is trained to fix your RZR... often cheaper in the long run to let them get things working. When you become a regular customer you will get good service!!!!!

 

When you become a regular customer you will get good service!!!!!

So if I don't need to take it to the dealer very often than that means I get bad service? :think:

 

You need to replace the armature plate if it is even slightly distorted, and then energize the coil with a battery and lay the plate on top and try and turn or spin the armature plate it should be very strong

 

Hey guys, now that were on the awd FAQs. I have a 2012 900xp rzr and I'm haven some groning noses under my feel when I put my foot in it, I can also feel it in the steering wheel a little to. Is this normal for The 900 xp rzr. I got it "new" (as a demo)

 

Thanks again for the help rd. As soon as I check out the coil and armature plate I will post the results. I am going to use a battery and the machine as my gut is telling me it might be an electrical connection that is causing my problem. If it is, then the test should let me know. If it works hooked to the battery and not with the plug in the machine then there is my answer. I am not discounting the possibility of the armature plate but from my limited knowledge of this differential it looks like it is in really good shape. The armature looks perfect, tabs all look the same and not twisted, the two wear patterns on it are even and where they should be. I was actually really surprised when I took the cover off it. It looked brand new in there, was nice to know the previous owner had not abused the machine.

100% agree about dealer. Installers of new parts rather than mechanics a lot of the time. Replace everything is not the best solution.

 

Hi all,

Wanted to give an update as I think (fingers crossed) I have found my problem. I bench tested the magnet and it works fine. Pretty hard to move the armature on it so I don't think it is the armature but I am going to replace it anyway.

I looked over the sprague carrier extremely closely and was talking with a friend about whether I should replace it or not. By chance, the sunlight hit it just perfect and there they were, three hairline cracks in it that are barely visible but they are there. Now that I can spot them I can see the plastic around the rollers where the cracks are is protruding on the inside just slightly. It has been sitting on my bench for a few days now. When it first came out with a light film of oil on it the cracks were invisible. Now that it is dry and clean the cracks are visible.

I am about to order the sprague from superatv. I will post more about the install as I go and if it really did fix my problem. I think it will. Thanks all in advance. Would have never known where to look without this forum.