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post #1 of 18 Old August 25th, 2019, 05:31 AM Thread Starter
 
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Fusible link blowing

Anybody had issues with blowing the main chassis fusible link up near the starter solenoid ? I've blown 3 in 2 months, and it's always after washing the dash. I'm pretty certain water is getting down into a new headlight switch that was installed about 3 months ago. That's the only thing that has changed on the dash. Although I find it hard to believe it would cause enough of a load to blow the fusible link and not the fuses. I'm thinking about replacing the fusible link, I'm just not smart enough to figure out what size fuse I need to cover the load, and still protect the wiring.

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post #2 of 18 Old August 25th, 2019, 12:40 PM
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Re: Fusible link blowing

Tommy,
Is it always the same fusible link?
Blue links go to VR, black link goes to fuse panel.

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post #3 of 18 Old August 25th, 2019, 01:13 PM
 
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Re: Fusible link blowing

Quote:
Originally Posted by tekrsq View Post
Anybody had issues with blowing the main chassis fusible link up near the starter solenoid ? I've blown 3 in 2 months, and it's always after washing the dash. I'm pretty certain water is getting down into a new headlight switch that was installed about 3 months ago. That's the only thing that has changed on the dash. Although I find it hard to believe it would cause enough of a load to blow the fusible link and not the fuses. I'm thinking about replacing the fusible link, I'm just not smart enough to figure out what size fuse I need to cover the load, and still protect the wiring.
yeah that. I'd bet there is a short to ground on that particular wire from the link. Follow that sucker very carefully and see if it's grounding on something metal.
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post #4 of 18 Old August 25th, 2019, 01:43 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Fusible link blowing

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Originally Posted by CA 800 View Post
Tommy,
Is it always the same fusible link?
Blue links go to VR, black link goes to fuse panel.
Yeah, it's always the black going to the fuse block. The 2 blues are disconnected because I don't have the stock VR setup.

Like I said, it's always after I shut it off, after I wash the dash area. It seems to be fine long as it stays running. I don't pressure wash it, it's always sponge washed, and lightly rinsed with the hose. I thought water was getting into the fuse block, but it's dry, and the fuses are fine in there. I thought about the ignition, and haven't ruled it out, because none of the blade fuses were blown.....only the fusible link.

The second time it happened, I pulled out the wiring harness and inspected it (out of the loom) from the starter solenoid to the firewall. It looks fine.

The only thing "new" is the headlight switch, and the first time it happened, I noticed the headlights flashed a second or so after shutting down the machine. When I went to restart it, it was dead.... but I wouldn't think there would be enough juice through it to blow the main fusible link before the blade fuse.

I've got a couple of new links on the way, but I'm playing with the idea of temporarily installing a blade fuse in the line, and systematically pouring water on each dash switch to see if I can get it to blow. Just need to find time to do it.

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post #5 of 18 Old August 25th, 2019, 01:59 PM
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Re: Fusible link blowing

How does the fan circuit breaker look?

If you look at the 08 harness break outs the black fusible link also feeds the fan circuit breaker, and there have been all kinds of problems with those circuit breakers.

Are you receiving the black (1.0mm) link?

2202607 blue .8mm 18 gauge
2202670 black 1.0mm 16 gauge

Don't quote me, but is from the internet, so it must be true:
"Typically, fusible link should be 4 gauges smaller than the circuit wire."
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post #6 of 18 Old August 25th, 2019, 02:10 PM
 
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Re: Fusible link blowing

Quote:
Originally Posted by tekrsq View Post

I've got a couple of new links on the way, but I'm playing with the idea of temporarily installing a blade fuse in the line, and systematically pouring water on each dash switch to see if I can get it to blow. Just need to find time to do it.
Iv'e used circuit breakers inline temporarily while trying to diagnose. I don't think I would go over a 15 amp tops on a CB. If you did a fuse a 20 or 30 is probably fine. If the CB kicks on and off repeatedly disconnect it cause it's a direct short.

One like this with eyelets and wire to hook it up:


https://www.amazon.com/Bussmann-CBC-...ateway&sr=8-16

Also, I can't see water causing such a bad, high amp draw short but stranger things have happened I guess.
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Last edited by RZR_Scott; August 25th, 2019 at 02:18 PM.
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post #7 of 18 Old August 25th, 2019, 03:22 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Fusible link blowing

Quote:
Originally Posted by CA 800 View Post
How does the fan circuit breaker look?

If you look at the 08 harness break outs the black fusible link also feeds the fan circuit breaker, and there have been all kinds of problems with those circuit breakers.

Are you receiving the black (1.0mm) link?

2202607 blue .8mm 18 gauge
2202670 black 1.0mm 16 gauge

Don't quote me, but is from the internet, so it must be true:
"Typically, fusible link should be 4 gauges smaller than the circuit wire."
Yeah, I'm getting the 1.0mm link. It's black, and clearly marked on it. I know fusible links are smaller gauge than the protected wire, but didn't know it was 4 gauges smaller. The main wire looks to be a 10g, so the fusible link is an 18g wire ?? I don't see how that would support the normal draw through the fuse block ??

As far as I can tell, the fan CB is fine. I haven't had any problems with it kicking on, and when I checked the harness, it didn't look corroded. It's a few years old, I guess I can replace it just to be safe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RZR_Scott View Post
Iv'e used circuit breakers inline temporarily while trying to diagnose. I don't think I would go over a 15 amp tops on a CB. If you did a fuse a 20 or 30 is probably fine. If the CB kicks on and off repeatedly disconnect it cause it's a direct short.

One like this with eyelets and wire to hook it up:


https://www.amazon.com/Bussmann-CBC-...ateway&sr=8-16

Also, I can't see water causing such a bad, high amp draw short but stranger things have happened I guess.
That's the same style used for the fan CB. I was thinking I'd use a 20 amp blade fuse. That should be more than enough without the fan running, and still blow quick enough to keep from hurting the wire.

I'm with you as far as not believing water will cause that short, but it has about 40 hrs on it since the 1st one blew...without ANY issues except immediately after washing the dash. I power wash the exterior and undercarriage, then wash the interior when I can (sometimes several days later). Not to mention, been through water up to seat level...no problems. What I don't understand is why it waits until I shut it down to blow ?? Maybe next time I'll leave it running and blow out the dash with the air compressor. lol.
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post #8 of 18 Old August 25th, 2019, 04:23 PM
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Re: Fusible link blowing

Per the 2008 wiring diagram, the wire from battery to fuse box is 12ga.
4 gauges smaller would be 16ga wire, which is what the black link is.
It feeds a 5, 15, & 20 amp fuse and the 20 amp circuit breaker for the fan,for a max of 60 amps.

Per below chart the max you should push down a short length of 12 gage wire is 35 amps, before you experience voltage drop. I suspect it would take some what more to produce smoke.

The advantage of fusible links is they can sustain near max load for short periods with out blowing. Fuse blow instantly when you reach their limit.

You may find that a 20 amp fuse will trip to often, with everything on and may end up at 30 or 40 amps to eliminate nuisance fuse blowing.


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post #9 of 18 Old August 25th, 2019, 05:12 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Fusible link blowing

Quote:
Originally Posted by CA 800 View Post
Per the 2008 wiring diagram, the wire from battery to fuse box is 12ga.
4 gauges smaller would be 16ga wire, which is what the black link is.
It feeds a 5, 15, & 20 amp fuse and the 20 amp circuit breaker for the fan,for a max of 60 amps.

Per below chart the max you should push down a short length of 12 gage wire is 35 amps, before you experience voltage drop. I suspect it would take some what more to produce smoke.

The advantage of fusible links is they can sustain near max load for short periods with out blowing. Fuse blow instantly when you reach their limit.

You may find that a 20 amp fuse will trip to often, with everything on and may end up at 30 or 40 amps to eliminate nuisance fuse blowing.
Nice info !!!!

You sure the 20 amp fan CB runs off that ? I was planning to just use the 20 amp to troubleshoot, but it's nice to know I can get away with a 40 amp fuse. Might try a 40 or 50 amp manual reset CB on it.

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post #10 of 18 Old August 25th, 2019, 08:05 PM
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Re: Fusible link blowing

The schematic shows red wire going to 3 fuses in fuse box, and then out to fan circuit breaker.

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post #11 of 18 Old August 26th, 2019, 02:53 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Fusible link blowing

Quote:
Originally Posted by CA 800 View Post
The schematic shows red wire going to 3 fuses in fuse box, and then out to fan circuit breaker.
Ok, I see it. But that schematic looks like the red wire only powers the 15a & 20a. I think it powers the 5a as well. Either way, it looks like it has a 40a max draw. I should be able to put a 40 amp blade fuse or resettable breaker in there to replace that fusible link if I have to. I'd like to keep the fusible link if possible, but that thing is a total pain in the ass to change out. Like I said, I got another headlight switch and fusible link on the way, and then I'll do some trouble shooting. THX !!!!!!
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post #12 of 18 Old August 30th, 2019, 05:38 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Fusible link blowing

Got my hands on an 11 800 service manual. It looks like there is a group of 3 fuses coming off the starter solenoid, where the fusible links are in my 08. BUT, it looks like on the 30 amp chassis fuse, there is still a small section of fusible link. Can anybody confirm if this is there or not ??

If they replaced the fusible links in the 11+ models with a 30amp fuse, then that's what I'll be doing to mine.

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post #13 of 18 Old August 31st, 2019, 12:20 AM
 
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Fusible link blowing

Quote:
Originally Posted by tekrsq View Post
Got my hands on an 11 800 service manual. It looks like there is a group of 3 fuses coming off the starter solenoid, where the fusible links are in my 08. BUT, it looks like on the 30 amp chassis fuse, there is still a small section of fusible link. Can anybody confirm if this is there or not ??

If they replaced the fusible links in the 11+ models with a 30amp fuse, then that's what I'll be doing to mine.
Mine is a 2014. It has a 20 amp CB and looks like 2 small red wires bundled with it, from the starter sol right down to that big harness, no fuses near there.
Right next to that there a one fuse-able link also going right down to that same big harness.

I'll look through my Clymer Manual and see what it shows.

On the 08 it shows 3 wires off the solenoid, 2 going to the voltage reg and one to the fuse box powering everything. If the fuse link to the fuse box is cooking the only reason it would be there is because of the CB for the fan. I would run a new wire dedicated to that fan CB to the batt solenoid. The reason I say that is my 2014 is like that, fan CB right at the battery the other is straight to the fuse box. You could always put a 30amp breaker on that one just in case it is shorted somewhere. Just FYI your light switch has a 15 amp fuse for the switch.

11 and 12 have 2 fuse boxes. says power fuse box and relay/fuse box.

On the 2014 the fuse link goes to the regulator only, the CB goes to the fan relay, the other 2 go to the power fuse box, 30 amp to a chassis relay and a20 amp to the EFI it says.

Pic is 2008 in my Clymer manual. Click image for larger version

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You can see the two wires going to the regulator in the pic, the other goes straight to the fuse box and powers all the fuses and the fan’s 20 amp CB.

Anyway, ya, I would dedicate that fan CB to the soleniod/batt and dedicate the other to the fuse box. Put a 30A CB on the fuse box one just to protect the wire. Move the fan CB to near the battery also.Click image for larger version

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s
The last pic is showing the 2008 fuse box, #1 red wire is yours from the sol that keeps blowing. See how it goes to everything INCLUDING THE FAN CB? That, I would run it's own wire for. A 12 gauge should work nicely, this way you can eliminate that stupid fuse link.....

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post #14 of 18 Old August 31st, 2019, 05:39 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Fusible link blowing

THX Scott !!!!!!!

That kind of confirms what I thought, but I didn't have the issue until I replaced the headlight switch. I forgot to mention I have the Polaris brand LED wiring harness in mine because I have an 11 front fascia with hi/low LED lights. It came with a switch (I think it's a Ranger headlight switch), but the switch only worked a couple of months. So I replaced it with a Carlin rocker. That works fine, except after the dash gets wet. Then it blows the fusible link. I truly think it's in the switch. I ordered a Ranger headlight switch, but haven't had a chance to put it in yet.

I hate to modify the stock wiring if I can help it. The engineers did it that way for a reason, and I understand why a fusible link is where it is. It's just a pain in the ass to change out. BUT if I can't get this sorted out, I think I'll wire it as you suggested. Polaris obviously changed the design for a reason. Although the CB for my fan is on the firewall. I think I'll leave it there to keep it out of the mud.

THX again, brother.

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post #15 of 18 Old August 31st, 2019, 10:56 AM
 
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Re: Fusible link blowing

Quote:
Originally Posted by tekrsq View Post
THX Scott !!!!!!!

That kind of confirms what I thought, but I didn't have the issue until I replaced the headlight switch. I forgot to mention I have the Polaris brand LED wiring harness in mine because I have an 11 front fascia with hi/low LED lights. It came with a switch (I think it's a Ranger headlight switch), but the switch only worked a couple of months. So I replaced it with a Carlin rocker. That works fine, except after the dash gets wet. Then it blows the fusible link. I truly think it's in the switch. I ordered a Ranger headlight switch, but haven't had a chance to put it in yet.

I hate to modify the stock wiring if I can help it. The engineers did it that way for a reason, and I understand why a fusible link is where it is. It's just a pain in the ass to change out. BUT if I can't get this sorted out, I think I'll wire it as you suggested. Polaris obviously changed the design for a reason. Although the CB for my fan is on the firewall. I think I'll leave it there to keep it out of the mud.

THX again, brother.
No problem, ya I just like to put them close to the battery to protect the wire, especially if its a big wire.

Maybe it's that Carlin, if it has a ground in it for an internal bulb that's a possibility. Either way it really should have it's own fuse and not kill your whole car if it shorts. So, ya, just make sure it's tied in after the light fuse or run a wire and fuse for it too.

And yes, Polaris certainly changed that design for a reason I would say, that fan really needs it's own power. It is interesting that a cooling fan has a CB and not a fuse, my guess is it's because the fan is subject to hitting water/mud periodically. When you physically slow/stop a motor it will pull lots of juice, and that would pop a fuse.

I think after looking at that 2008 800 any accessory should have it's own power and fuse. If it were mine, problems or not, I would run another feed for that fan for sure.

Short circuit breaker story for you.....
I did lots of electrical work on cops cars (among other work) before I retired and we had a guy installing equipment who apparently didn't understand a CB's purpose. We had a few cars that were towed in that had caught fire, some pretty bad too. One day I was assigned one of them to fix/rewire. Well, he ran a 8 gauge wire from the battery to the control box for the light bar, they needed a big wire because in those days there were no LEDs, it was all halogen and motors for rotation. They pulled close to 30 amps with all the lights on, that's why it needed an 8 gauge wire. Anyway he decided to put a circuit breaker in line to protect it all. Problem is he put it inside the car and not at the battery! The wire was shorting at the firewall with no protection and you can guess what an 8 gauge does with a direct short! After that I had him move the CB to the battery and I changed the ones already done as they came in for other service. Your tax dollars at work, ahaha.

Let us know what you do and find on your 800, I'm really curious.
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